Who thinks DERBY ICONS is done for good now?

[crownimpin]

Not saying this whole ordeal with Gary is a good thing, but I think this maybe the end for DI. They should have had a mandatory rollbar rule..


RIP Gary Littlejohn.

[crusher71]

ILL GET BLAMED IF THEY DISBAND....ACCIDENTS CAN AND DO HAPPEN, THATS THE RISK WE ALL TAKE DERBYING. ITS NO SOLACE FOR HIS FAMILY I AM SURE. MAYBE POSITIVE CHANGES WILL COME ABOUT FROM THIS GRAVE SITUATION AND SOME CHANGES WILL BE MADE TO ALL PROMOTERS RULES..I HAVE SEEN HORRIFIC FIRES, GUYS GET BROKEN ARMS AND LEGS, CONCUSSIONS, BUT NEVER WOULD WANT TO WITNESS ANYONES DEATH.....LETS FIGURE OUT A WAY TO MINIMIZE THIS INCIDENT FROM BECOMING THE NORM.......

[yousoldout]

what did i miss over the weekend?

[yousoldout]

ok so i went over there and read it......

i used to tell gard all the time......(and it got deleted of course) that hard cars will not be the death of someone motors will.....
and that cages need to go to the frame and cars need an 8 pt cage connected to the frame......
and that when ya give more of a darn about fly $hit on a frame than safety.....bad things will happen

hate to say i told ya so jesus boy........but i told u so......

[David Bryan]

Hello. Done for good? I sense a little hate there. I do not think they are done for good. They are set up as an LLC. (Limited Liability), unless they let that payment slip by? There will be litigation, that is for sure. Another thing for sure is, that this could go on for years. I for one do not think things will happen very fast. Court cases can be drawn out for a long, long time. Scott Gropp may be the one to ask about such things. Time will tell.
I do know they will take more time in looking at safety. (See above post). (Not so sure about an 8 point cage though). The past weekend should make them better, so time will tell. One thing that does make me wonder (also about myself...Mad Raptor awards), is that they scream over the load speaker about making a great hit, make another hit, harder, doing alot of damage, etc....ICON Instagater...? How will that play into the courts and judge's ruling? You want role overs, but do not require a roll over bar or halo? HHMMM??? I know how I would rule, but that is just me. Time will tell.

Rest in peace Gary. My thoughts AND MANY prayers. David Bryan

[yousoldout]

this should be a thread to talk about the issues that wont be talked about elsewhere

that being said...talking about the issues that surround a tragedy DOES NOT equal lack of sympathy for the loss of someone in an avoidable accident...i say that cause someone's gonna read this and go "how dare you"....

yes it sucks...some kids lost a dad for no reason of his own...thats just wrong

"thoughts and prayers" are nice and a swell gesture but they dont help prevent stuff like this goind forward...."thoughts and prayers" wont put food on the table for these kids or pay for college....

(PSA over)

very true D.Bryan....
encouraging people to go out there drive like nuts, no regard for anything and being rewarded for it....ouch....
for 2 long promoters have ignored 'the worse case scenario' (i used to bring it up it would get deleted over on the other place, for their wallets right now that may be a good thing)

this isn't a 'derby icons' problem....it's an every promoter, fairboard, venue problem
-structural integrity of cars is both scrutinized (frame welding) and overlooked (safety features).....thats a dereliction of duty
-and meanwhile whats a 'level playing field' really isnt because of the beasts under some of those hoods...which by the way get no scrutiny
-couple all of that with the 'go out and hit hard or else'
you get the worse case scenario....
the 'new' way of doing things is a formula for disaster....

as stated in my PSA.....its a shame some kids lost their dad all for this dumb sport and some mythical 'level playing field'
now do whats right and take care of the wife and kids for a long time

[jaygreen80]

The man made a decision to NOT put a halo bar in his vehicle. Would it have saved him? Maybe it would have but nobody really knows. Ultimately he paid the price for it. It's no different than hopping into your daily driver and not buckling your seat belt.

I am truly sorry that he lost his life, I'd never want to see anyone injured or let alone killed in this sport but I don't think that DI is to blame, or any other promoter would be to blame if something like this happened at one of their shows. Will things change now, yes I'm sure that they will. Unfortunately sometimes something like this has to happen to make things change.

[11compact]

How can you blame DI for not having a mandated roll ever bar in their rules when this derby didn't even use DI rules? This was the CFD's derby using their rules not DI

[crusher71]

COMMON SENSE. IF DERBY ICONS WAS PROMOTING/INSPECTING/ADVERTISING/RUNNING, HANDING OUT ICON INSTIGATOR AWARDS FOR "HEAVY HITTING"/ PUTTING THE SHOW ON, THEY SHOULD(KEYWORD-SHOULD AS ITS TOO LATE NOW, BUT NOT IN THE FUTURE) INSISTED THAT CERTAIN CRITERIA BE FOLLOWED AS FAR AS DRIVER SAFETY AND A MINIMIZING OF RISK INVOLVED. WILL THEY ? I WOULD BET THAT MORE THAN A FEW THINGS CHANGE IN LIEU OF THE INCIDENT ON SATURDAY. I ALSO HAVE SEEN OVER THE COURSE OF 30 YEARS, SOME VERY, VERY BAD WELDERS, AND WELDING OF CAGES. IT SEEMS THAT ALOT OF PEOPLE CANT CORRECTLY USE A MEASURING TAPE AND THEN WELD IN PIECES OF SCRAP/BOLTS/ WHATEVER IS LAYING ON THE SHOP FLOOR INTO GAPS IN CAGES AND HALO BARS.... PATHETIC, AND VERY UNSAFE... WHEN I POINTED OUT TO AN OFFICIAL A FEW YEARS BACK THAT A GUY HAD ONLY TACKE WELDED HIS HALO BAR IN AND COVERED THE JOINTS WITH DUCT TAPE, I GOT A GREAT RESPONSE" ITS HIS FAULT IS HE GETS HURT OR KILLED, NOT MINE, I JUST RUN THE DERBY, I DONT BUILD THE CARS".... NOW THATS A GUY WHO ONLY CARES ABOUT THE MONEY, AND IF DRIVERS HAVE TO BE INJURED OR KILLED DUE TO INEPTNESS OF PROMOTERS, IM OUT......ENGINES OUT OF HAND? NOT SURE BUT WHEN I SEE CARS AND TRUCKS JACKED TO THE MOON IN FRONT AND DRAGGING ON THE GROUND IN BACK, ITS A RECIPE FOR DISASTER. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE OLD RULES OF " CAR MUST SIT LEVEL? IMAGINE WHAT WOULD EVERYONE WHO HAS BRAINWASHED THEMSELVES INTO THINKING A VIC NEEDS TO LOOK LIKE ITS JUMPING THE SNAKE RIVER CANYON DO?? THEY WOULD BE LOST........ BUT THEY MIGHT LIVE LONGER...... IF ANY MOTOR SPORTS NEEDS TO HAVE SOME NEW POLICIES SET FORTH, ITS DEMOLITION DERBY..... ITS WAYYYYYY PAST DUE.......... I AM SURE TORY AND DAVE ARE FORMULATING SOME POSTING OR RESPONSE TO ALL OF THIS THAT HAS TRANSPIRED.. I DONT THINK WE ARE OUT OF THE WOODS YET........ MORE LIKE JUST ENTERING IT..........

[yousoldout]

preparing a response? well we're 3 days out now and still
im sure it has something to do with lawyering up....but no prepared response, no nothing 72 hours later....from a supposed god fearing man and a military guy....thats gutless

and swanny calls us misfits.....

[yousoldout]

"a piece of paper with some 'rules' on it is kinda insulting.....i dont need someone to tell me how to build a derby car "

Read more: wesmash.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=2051&page=4#ixzz2BReQBAQ2

thats a direct quote from me from last week on a previous thread

car builds....
a vast majority of derbiers cannot weld. i mean, how many pictures have ya seen online of people building their cars in a mud hole in front of their trailer...
the car sitting level or not isn't the problem....it's when you have a dumb kid behind the wheel afraid he's gonna get in trouble when he doesnt hit hard....and he does something us vets wouldnt do

we ignore the officials when they say 'hit hard'....a 20 something punk kid doesnt know any better.....with his 400hp motor and reckless abandon driving he's gonna hurt someone or himself
promoters have created the 'hit hard or go home' and 'follow MY rules or go home' mentality....both of those are self destructive and HAVE now gotten someone killed

high low it doesnt matter....build em stout....the drivers compartment needs a cage front a arms to rear humps all connected to a roll over bar.....in ohio this was legal up until mid 80s....then 'whiners' (mainly the people who cant weld) made them 'illegal'....the speed and power of todays derby motor isnt going away....the cars need to be able to handle that impact and frankly.....anything newer than 1977 just isn't built for it

yes the cars will be hard but guess what.....safe

that also means some people shouldnt be participating because of their lack of basic mechanical skills....hey i wanna play in the nba but im slow and white....tough

[darren46d]

Nov 6, 2012 7:27:33 GMT -5 yousoldout said:

preparing a response? well we're 3 days out now and still
im sure it has something to do with lawyering up....but no prepared response, no nothing 72 hours later....from a supposed god fearing man and a military guy....thats gutless

and swanny calls us misfits.....

Ok, I have kept silent about this whole matter simply out of respect for Gary and his family. After all the man hasn't even been laid to rest yet. We know you don't like DI by all your posts and you have every right to post them. However in this case before stating the above comment, give it a little bit of time. There is more to this then just DI. You have them, the CVFD, the county of Vermilion and wouldn't suprise me if the city of Cayuga isn't somehow involved. They have had basically one business day to contact all the insurance companies, lawyers and anyone else who may have to get involved. I am sure all parties involved are being instructed to not say anything and there hands are tied not by there choice. I know one person off the CVFD that is very, very religous and I imagine it is bugging him not being able to get on here and express his condolences. I don't think for one minute any person I have ever met in the derby community is that cold blooded to not want to express sorrow in a tragedy such as this one.

Don't get me wrong on this subject. If I thought your comments were fair and just, I wouldn't say a word. However, in fairness to ALL parties involved, give it some time before you go ripping people. If anything else at least wait untill the man is laid to rest out of respect to him and his family.

[yousoldout]

some people only read what they want to read....scroll up

"that being said...talking about the issues that surround a tragedy DOES NOT equal lack of sympathy for the loss of someone in an avoidable accident...i say that cause someone's gonna read this and go "how dare you"....yes it sucks...some kids lost a dad for no reason of his own...thats just wrong"

and

...."thoughts and prayers" wont put food on the table for these kids or pay for college....

dont you FN point me out to be a monster......
ill put my moral compass up against anyone and i'll win 97% of the time

and...i wrote

im sure it has something to do with lawyering up....

you repeated I am sure all parties involved are being instructed to not say anything

this isn't about hate....it's not about you me or them....stop reading what isn't there......

it's about whats right.....

and this whole thing is just not right....im upset because i told them....im upset because it happened....i friggin told dave gard it would happen.....and i got labeled hater, kool aid drinker....all he would do is call me names......
worried about the size of a weld on a bumper bracket....how insignificant
im sorry i dont express being upset with 'praying' and 'condolences'

dont confuse hatred with doing what is just

[crusher71]

PEOPLE SAY THE EXACT SAME THING ABOUT ME. I ONLY POINT OUT WHAT IS WRONG..... AND THATS NOT TRUE, I POINT OUT THINGS THAT ARE GREAT AS WELL, BUT THE GREAT THINGS DONT NEED FIXING..... THE BAD STUFF, WHEN BROUGHT OUT INTO THE LIGHT FOR ALL TO SEE, THEN HAS MORE OF A CHANCE TO GET FIXED......DRIVERS HAVE BEEN SILENT FOR FAR TOO LONG, AFRAID TO "ROCK THE BOAT OR BE SINGLED OUT"....WELL, YOU KNOW WHAT? AFTER SATURDAY, ITS PAST TIME TO SPEAK UP AND CORRECT INJUSTICES AND MAKE THINGS RIGHT. BUT THAT DOESNT MEAN THAT THINGS CANNOT CHANGE.. WITHOUT THE DRIVERS, THERE IS NO DERBY.......

[yousoldout]

well a response got posted

accountability

that's a start

but waaaaaay 2 late imo from someone who "love this sport and the drivers more than anyone will ever know"